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Post by Renathan on Sept 22, 2019 8:57:04 GMT -6
ALRIGHTY due to new information that has been revealed; my previous ruling on Diurnal Spirit and Night-vision have to be changed. I apologize.
Diurnal Spirit and Night-Vision will ONLY protect against 'additional' effects.
So, if the move says
MOVE I do [Damage] and then [blaghblaghblaghnondamage].
Then they would negate the and then [blaghblaghblaghnondamage], but not the damage.
but if the move says
Move I do [blaghblaghblaghnondamage].
Then it doesn't work at all against the move, and the move will work.
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Sorry for the previous wrong answer, sometimes we get extra information after the answers.
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Post by Noa on Sept 22, 2019 10:39:28 GMT -6
In that case, I've got questions re: Natural Antivenom and Iron Will again: This ability would split into these discrete effects?
1. Immune to all DoT damage from poison/venom/toxin based moves (takes initial damage but no DoT effects; would not protect against moves like Devour or Smouldering Goop) 2. Not affected by secondary effects of acid-based attacks (same as Diurnal Spirit/Nightvision, but for acid) 3. Immune to any 'disease' and 'sickness' based attacks, regardless of effect (ie Plague, Plague Breath, Mind Rot, Decay)
And regarding Iron Will, does the clarification extend to that one as well? ie Iron Will is basically just a combo of Nightvision and Diurnal Spirit + Psychic, all rolled into one?
I'm particularly curious about this since I've looked through the psychic moves and I don't think any of them have a 'secondary' effect. Maybe I missed it or I'm not understanding correctly, but they all either just deal damage or apply an effect (or several), not both.
For reference, I'm going to make a list of the moves I could find from Light/Dark/Acid that both do damage and apply an effect:
Not actually 100% sure on whether these three would apply ^
Actually, upon looking through Light moves, I saw something in the description for Cure that seemed relevant: It seems to count 'stat drains' and DoTs as 'secondary effects'. This is the second move/ability now (the first being Iron Will with dizziness, mind control, confusion, etc.) where they explicitly state examples of 'secondary effects' that are... usually the only effects of moves that deal them, as far as I can tell.
I don't think Cure is rendered useless by defining 'secondary' as 'any additional effects from a damage dealing move' or anything, but this is just contributing to the ambiguity of the definition of 'secondary' for me x3;
I think maybe a tag for moves with effects counted as 'secondary' would be really helpful too.
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Post by Renathan on Sept 24, 2019 9:27:34 GMT -6
Sorry it has taken me so long to get back to you, we've had a lot going on lately.
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Natural Antivenom: -As long as it is an acid move, it is immune to the DoT damage. -Secondary effects, usually they fall under DoT or illness of some kind. The only exceptions are Toxin, Venom, and Sleeping Venom which are single effect, but will be resisted due to the phrasing. Stuff like Devour and Impediment goop won't be affected by N.A. -Disease and Sickness, there's only 4 of those so far.
Iron Will: -It is only mental attacks (IE: Sparkling dust and Whirlwind would be able to be countered, and those don't get countered by this.) -Psychic stuff with secondary effects are kinda like this- Mind Control & Mental Theft. -Darkness- counts with Nightvision and with Iron Will. -Terror- mentality is still lost, but the target doesn't have to flee. This one also counts with Nightvision too. -Bathe in light counts with Diurnal Spirit and with Iron Will.
Other Iron Will Stuff: -Ebil Nom works as normal and isn't effected. -Shadow Strike is not affected since it attacks a shadow and not a mind? -Curses; only one can affect a target at once time and are not resisted by Nightvision or Iron Will. -Rainbow doesn't have secondary effects, and it has three options. It isn't effected by anything. -Prismatic Light is above the elements so it isn't effected by anything.
Cure: - Damages over time are their own separate category different from secondary affects when it comes to Nightvision/Diurnal/Iron Will because the latter abilities specify 'secondary effects that are not damage'. Also DoTs are recent, so some of the terminology is a tad wonky ATM apparently. - Cure removes any negative numerical effect, both damage and stat drain, regardless of the source. It can fix Bleeding (which it would fix with the 5 stamina healing since any healing removes Bleeding). - Curses are not affected by Cure.
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Whew, this is all super complicated and just... Wow. Lots of questions. Thanks for separating them out for us.
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